Someone keeps stealing my little religious statues out of my cemetery garden. My dad, my mom, and my brother are buried there. My spot is there but thankfully I am not yet. Anyway I’m not even mad about it because whoever took them just invited my mom to haunt them, they have no idea what they did lol FAFO
Do not be sorry of being the bearer of bad news. But happily, men die and they die and leave the old women alone with friends that they choose and sometimes a little bit of money. I have small discussion and interactions with these very old women, and I laugh a lot with them. I am old myself, 72 years old.
These women have children who are very old too, and these children have children too and these children have also children. So they are much more than great grand mothers elles sont des arrière grands mères heureuses d'être débarassées de Maris qu'elles ont aimé pour ce qu'ils sont, mais là elles sont libres de discuter et de nager entre copines dans un des meilleurs endroits du monde
I believe it. I’ve been digging into my family tree for the past year and while I can find obituaries for all my male ancestors back to the 1800s, I only found an obituary for one female ancestor. It’s like all the women who came before me never existed, except for one, who as you outlined, was described for her roles as a wife and mother.
In my home town in North Wales there is a plaque on a bridge dedicated to a local husband and wife. She is described as a "lovely unassuming woman." It gives me the ick factor every time I see it
Based on this perhaps we need to adapt the Bechdel test to Obituaries:
(1) The woman in question is featured based on her own accomplishments, rather than in reference to her better known male counterpart ( husband/partner/mentor) (2)Her accomplishments are not tempered, measured by her looks, conventional feminine behavior (eg ability to bake cookies), (3) they are represented at least 50% of the time
When I wrote my mom‘s obituary I made sure to call her bad ass for having two home births.
I also talked about how she gave up all her happiness for her kids, and how women shouldn’t do that because their kids don’t even want that. It just made her miserable and left us feeling guilty.
I don’t know how many people even read it, but I hope women listen to that part.
It is only published on the funeral home’s website because all the newspapers around here wanted something like $400 each to publish a obituary. Nobody in my family would want anyone in my family paying $400 to a newspaper to publish an obituary, so I didn’t for anyone.
Thank you for sharing. If more women wrote honestly about their female relatives, and if more magazines published it, the narrative around women's lives and achievements would change at an even quicker pace.
Colleen McCullough passed away in 2015 and I recalled EVERYONE being obsessed with “The Thorn Birds” in the 70s…the book, the miniseries, the record breaking sale of the paperback rights for almost 2 million dollars. Her obit read “COLLEEN McCullough, Australia’s best selling author, was a charmer. Plain of feature, and certainly overweight, she’s was, nevertheless, a woman of wit and warmth. In one interview, she said: “I’ve never been into clothes or figure and the interesting thing is I never had any trouble attracting men.”
This is so interesting. I love that you offered statistics.
I don’t mean to glamorize anything about the crap women receive but Virginia Woolf’s “Three Guineas” contains an insight that might make one almost prefer that, as long as the world is mostly run by men, women will not be equally lauded —since so many of the contributions men are lauded for are absolute shit like being the best exploiter of workers or contributing to wars. Not everything that is notable for obituaries is worth doing. Often, it is the opposite, and it would be better if no one had accomplished the harmful or worthless achievements the subject of an obit is lauded for.
I suppose there’s an accuracy issue in ignoring when women do these harmful things, assuming we are ignored.
My only point is that the notion of importance that is currently of note for obituaries isn’t necessarily so valuable. Impact is not always of value.
Though I would like obituaries to change because society has changed and better things than what currently makes someone important are valued instead.
That said, our contributions to the arts and sciences, other areas of knowledge, the betterment of society, and human development should be equally acknowledged, and undoubtedly we are not.
Bitter doesn't even begin to describe my feelings. Will anyone ever answer why we are valued less than men, even though we are both human beings? Who decided this?
It’s not discrimination if people simply don’t buy the papers. There's no conspiracy of chuckling moustache twirling men removing women from the obituaries. People just don't remember women like that.
You've decided to denigrate women here. You've decided that femininity, gentleness, nurturing is not respectable. That woman are only valuable when judged by male standards.
??? Wrong. Where did the author talk of ‘respectability’. And what exactly do you mean by “People just don't remember women like that”? Like what? Like women who are gender non-conforming? Where’s your evidence? You have not provided a logical argument and appear to just be trying to bait us with your anti -feminist statements.
We generally need to haunt more people who disrespect us. Amazingly written thank you!
Oh yes, definitely. Thank you, I'm glad you appreciated this piece!
Someone keeps stealing my little religious statues out of my cemetery garden. My dad, my mom, and my brother are buried there. My spot is there but thankfully I am not yet. Anyway I’m not even mad about it because whoever took them just invited my mom to haunt them, they have no idea what they did lol FAFO
I’ll come back downright evil if anyone messes around! I’ll bring the cats, too. All my cats have loved a bit of heinous fuckery.
Remember when the rocket scientist died and her NY Times obit devoted the first paragraph to her "mean beef stroganoff?"
Oh, yes. That was one of the most facepalm-inducing paragraphs I've ever read.
You're kidding. Shocking.
Do not be sorry of being the bearer of bad news. But happily, men die and they die and leave the old women alone with friends that they choose and sometimes a little bit of money. I have small discussion and interactions with these very old women, and I laugh a lot with them. I am old myself, 72 years old.
These women have children who are very old too, and these children have children too and these children have also children. So they are much more than great grand mothers elles sont des arrière grands mères heureuses d'être débarassées de Maris qu'elles ont aimé pour ce qu'ils sont, mais là elles sont libres de discuter et de nager entre copines dans un des meilleurs endroits du monde
Yep I am at the age where my friends who have parents who are still alive only have their mom and their mom now lives with them.
And these women are so happy! They are thriving without their husbands.
I believe it. I’ve been digging into my family tree for the past year and while I can find obituaries for all my male ancestors back to the 1800s, I only found an obituary for one female ancestor. It’s like all the women who came before me never existed, except for one, who as you outlined, was described for her roles as a wife and mother.
"It's like all the women who came before me never even existed" hits hard oof
If their names are written down to discover at all, the further you go back.
In my home town in North Wales there is a plaque on a bridge dedicated to a local husband and wife. She is described as a "lovely unassuming woman." It gives me the ick factor every time I see it
Well, who wouldn’t want to be remembered as ‘unassuming’, right? 🥴
Based on this perhaps we need to adapt the Bechdel test to Obituaries:
(1) The woman in question is featured based on her own accomplishments, rather than in reference to her better known male counterpart ( husband/partner/mentor) (2)Her accomplishments are not tempered, measured by her looks, conventional feminine behavior (eg ability to bake cookies), (3) they are represented at least 50% of the time
That's actually a really good idea!
This is excellent thank you
Thank you, glad you think so!
Excellent.
Thank you.
When I wrote my mom‘s obituary I made sure to call her bad ass for having two home births.
I also talked about how she gave up all her happiness for her kids, and how women shouldn’t do that because their kids don’t even want that. It just made her miserable and left us feeling guilty.
I don’t know how many people even read it, but I hope women listen to that part.
It is only published on the funeral home’s website because all the newspapers around here wanted something like $400 each to publish a obituary. Nobody in my family would want anyone in my family paying $400 to a newspaper to publish an obituary, so I didn’t for anyone.
Thank you for sharing. If more women wrote honestly about their female relatives, and if more magazines published it, the narrative around women's lives and achievements would change at an even quicker pace.
Well done! This was new info for me. I also don't frequent the obits - but that might change being of a certain age.
I suspect you'll be haunting a number of the 'old-boys club'. Go for IT !!
Colleen McCullough passed away in 2015 and I recalled EVERYONE being obsessed with “The Thorn Birds” in the 70s…the book, the miniseries, the record breaking sale of the paperback rights for almost 2 million dollars. Her obit read “COLLEEN McCullough, Australia’s best selling author, was a charmer. Plain of feature, and certainly overweight, she’s was, nevertheless, a woman of wit and warmth. In one interview, she said: “I’ve never been into clothes or figure and the interesting thing is I never had any trouble attracting men.”
Are. You. Kidding. Me. I’m still mad.
This is so interesting. I love that you offered statistics.
I don’t mean to glamorize anything about the crap women receive but Virginia Woolf’s “Three Guineas” contains an insight that might make one almost prefer that, as long as the world is mostly run by men, women will not be equally lauded —since so many of the contributions men are lauded for are absolute shit like being the best exploiter of workers or contributing to wars. Not everything that is notable for obituaries is worth doing. Often, it is the opposite, and it would be better if no one had accomplished the harmful or worthless achievements the subject of an obit is lauded for.
I suppose there’s an accuracy issue in ignoring when women do these harmful things, assuming we are ignored.
My only point is that the notion of importance that is currently of note for obituaries isn’t necessarily so valuable. Impact is not always of value.
Though I would like obituaries to change because society has changed and better things than what currently makes someone important are valued instead.
That said, our contributions to the arts and sciences, other areas of knowledge, the betterment of society, and human development should be equally acknowledged, and undoubtedly we are not.
Bitter doesn't even begin to describe my feelings. Will anyone ever answer why we are valued less than men, even though we are both human beings? Who decided this?
It’s not discrimination if people simply don’t buy the papers. There's no conspiracy of chuckling moustache twirling men removing women from the obituaries. People just don't remember women like that.
You've decided to denigrate women here. You've decided that femininity, gentleness, nurturing is not respectable. That woman are only valuable when judged by male standards.
??? Wrong. Where did the author talk of ‘respectability’. And what exactly do you mean by “People just don't remember women like that”? Like what? Like women who are gender non-conforming? Where’s your evidence? You have not provided a logical argument and appear to just be trying to bait us with your anti -feminist statements.
This makes sickening reading but it is also *sick* writing (in the modern sense i.e. great).